What makes AFv2 drop more ?

[Seventhseeker]

When doing Dynamis Xarcarbard and Beaucedine I have noticed that when our ls goes in with 18-24 we get less drops and when we have over 30 it seems we get better drops. There have been runs where we didn't get any AF or 100 pieces. Does it make a difference how many ppl we have in the zone? Also some of our THf players don't want to use a THF knife becasue they say it doesn't make any difference in drops. Some even say that THF Hands don't make much if any difference. I think there are some old wives tales out there too, like THF must kill for it to drop, THF must be in each party, THF must hit on the mob before it dies for vetter drops, If a SMN kills, it won't drop because it was a pet. We have had drops when a BLM kills so what is true and what is not? What make drops better?

[Izzy]

Well, the new Q/A with SE revealed that basically, if you have a THF with TH2+2 pull, you'll be getting maximum drop rates. This also clarified that you really only need one THF in zone.

[Seventhseeker]

Izzy, Do you have a link to that Q/A. I need to get this infor to our ls. Some will not change without a reliable source.

Thanks for the info

[Andhalas]

Tarutaru sacrifices works too

[Seventhseeker]

Noooooo, I'm too little and cute to die !!!

[Izzy]

Izzy, Do you have a link to that Q/A. I need to get this infor to our ls. Some will not change without a reliable source.

Thanks for the info
I can't find the official Q/A. Teorem has it though. Teo, could you post a link of it for him? (and me too since I haven't seen the real one)

[Spunkymage]

We've also found in an unauthorized study that Tarutaru WHM/NIN's using Randgrith on mobs in Dynamis have no bearing on the drops either.

[Teorem]

The only thing I have seen so far is coverage and translation of an article reviewing the event which was posted on Blue Gartr's forums: http://www.bluegartrls.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=25584 . The relevant question about Treasure Hunter is at the bottom of the first post.

As far as I know, SE has not yet put out an in-house translation of the QA panels, but they will likely do so on their main site within the next few days as they have done in the past for events of high interest.

The note about Xarcabard and Tavnazia AF drop rates being lower mainly due to the reduced number of enemies a linkshell kills is true as well.


AF Possibilities 100s Possibilites
Zone Vang. Hydra Kind. Total Statues V.Eyes V.Drg. Total
Bastok 319 0 0 319 164 0 0 164
San d'Oria 297 0 0 297 150 0 0 150
Windurst 306 0 0 306 146 0 0 146
Jeuno 301 0 0 301 151 0 0 151
Beaucedine 203 102 0 305 102 51 0 153
Xarcabard 0 0 301 301 12 138 10 16

Not many kill all the Hydra in Beaucedine and most Xarcabard runs involve killing only a fraction of the Kindred scattered around the zone. The killer in Tavnazia is the member limit and the amount of time that you spend working on necessary objectives (along with the inherent two-hour limit).

Thus, the best answers on how to get more AF and hundred pieces in any particular zone are:

1) Get your THFs involved more, making sure they have a non-zero amount of hate on everything you pull, and
2) Kill more.

[Seventhseeker]

Thanks for the information. I looked at the thread on Blue Garter and here is the text:

Q: Do multiple instances of Treasure Hunter in a single party increase the chances of a drop? When exactly does the effect of Treasure Hunter take place?
A: When more than one member has Treasure Hunter, the player with the strongest version will have theirs take effect for the party. The effect comes into play as soon as the Thief generates enmity from the target enemy. Even if the Thief dies, the effect remains.

Q: Why are the drop rates in Dynamis Xarcabard and Dynamis Tavnasia so horrible?
A: The drop rates are not different than any other nation's Dynamis. Since there are less enemies to defeat, it makes it appear as if the drop rate is that much worse.


What I get out of this is:

It says: When more than one member has Treasure Hunter, the player with the strongest version will have theirs take effect for the party.

Our linkshell puts a THF in melee party and BLM party because the majority of the kills were by these parties. The strategy we had been using was that as long as a THF was in the party and got in a few hits,, that was all that was needed. However, according to this statement the THF must get Enmity for Treasure Hunter to take effect. A THF would actually need to get initial hate before the rest of the group attacks due to the fact that once the group engages, it would not be likely that a THF would gain hate. If a slept mob was voked, it may prevent a THF from getting Enmity. This would mean that the way we play Dynamis would need to change. Also it is unclear that since Treasure Hunter takes effect for the party, would there need to be a THF in each party of the alliance. My thought on this is probably not

Your thoughts please

[plusx]

I am curious, has anyone done any tests on how aggro works in dynamis? (such as a Hide test?)

I ask this because, simply having the THF be the puller may not get him on the hate list of every mob. I would wager that the thf gets put on the hate list of the initial statue, and the mobs popped by that statue, however, any statue that links on the original one (and the mobs it pops) would not have the THF on the hate list.

The scenario of hate-free kiting comes to mind. Where a group of mobs are aggroed/linked and the initial mob killed, and the puller can then kite all of the remaining mobs while being healed without penalty. In this situation the mobs simply have aggro from linking, and there is no "hate list" created.

If the mobs are sight tracking, and Hide is used, the "linked" mobs will return to their original position. Apparently something similar to this occurs on true sight mobs IF in fact, the thf is not on the hate list of a mob. (Suji told me he can do this on Tiamat.)

I have probably done a really crappy job explaining this, and I may have suji write up a better explanation of it. I am simply questioning the idea that 1 TH4 thief as a main puller = TH4 being on EVERY mob pulled.

[Teorem]

The thread actually goes into debate about what a THF would need to do in order to "generate emnity" on the targets to what extent is needed to maximize the effect of Treasure Hunter. In this context, it definitely doesn't mean that they have to have more hate than anyone else at any particular point; it's just necessary to have a non-zero amount of hate on the target.

Essentially, the THF needs to get on their hate list, which is not accomplished by simple aggro (which only gets them targetted). If you are using a THF as your puller, the desired effect should be easily accomplished by the THF taking a melee or ranged shot at the other targets that spawned from the pull while wearing their Treasure Hunter+ gear. The gear can be swapped out for whatever else as soon as the THF gets on the targets' hate lists (by attempting to damage or use an ability on them).

I don't believe it's possible to Hide from enemies in Dynamis, as they aggro both sight and sound, although I can't say I've ever explicitly watched anyone try and it would be pretty trivial to test and see.

[KainHighwind]

http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/1730/thflr0.jpg

Brings back memories...

[Carmisse]

Haha Kain!! Oh yes it does... <3

[Jayiiq]

They didn't really say all that much in their answer, and the question specifically asked about parties. When I read that answer, I can't really take from it that you only need one THF in Dynamis, provided he gets hate on everything before it dies. I think it still has to do with which party (I'd hope alliance) gets the kill. When we started bringing tons of thieves, it did seem like the drops were increasing. It may have just been that we were killing more those times, but it's difficult to come to a conclusion without statistics.

Outside of Dynamis this makes sense. Only one alliance can kill any given mob, so if there's a THF and they get some hate on it, the TH will be applied when the alliance kills it. I really doubt that it's just a matter of any thief getting hate on it regardless of who gets the kill. That's what makes me unsure of Dynamis, since it's 64 people all fighting the same stuff.

[Izzy]

They didn't really say all that much in their answer, and the question specifically asked about parties. When I read that answer, I can't really take from it that you only need one THF in Dynamis, provided he gets hate on everything before it dies. I think it still has to do with which party (I'd hope alliance) gets the kill. When we started bringing tons of thieves, it did seem like the drops were increasing. It may have just been that we were killing more those times, but it's difficult to come to a conclusion without statistics.

Outside of Dynamis this makes sense. Only one alliance can kill any given mob, so if there's a THF and they get some hate on it, the TH will be applied when the alliance kills it. I really doubt that it's just a matter of any thief getting hate on it regardless of who gets the kill. That's what makes me unsure of Dynamis, since it's 64 people all fighting the same stuff.

However, mobs in Dynamis follow party dynamics. All mobs are red, filter settings for mobs you're fighting show every mob, because they're red. This leads me to believe that you need only one THF with max TH to have hate on everything to make the TH take effect.

[Andhalas]

http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/1730/thflr0.jpg

Brings back memories...

lol XD i wonder how many THF gonna be in 1 run if we say that again nowadays XD

[Zumi]

Say your killing Fafnir and you have 3 parties, and Fafnir is red to 1 party but purple to the 2 others in your allience. So say if the thf is in one of the parties when its purple when it dies does that mean you get TH or not.